CILIP 2.0 open session live blog here (from 2.30pm)

I will be live-blogging CILIP's open session about Web 2.0 here - from around 2.30pm when it starts.

Please add your comments, questions etc below

(everyone can comment, you do not need to be logged-in – and you don't need to wait until 2.30pm...)

Open session start -

(2:25: People streaming in to the room now, Council mostly in sitting, ready for the action...Phil Bradley just told me he'd never seen so much tech in such a small space..,)

2.30pm: ...  "Hello everybody..." says Lyndsay.

There are about 40 of us in total.

Caroline - leader of Council - now speaking, explaining the format. Lots of staff and guests round the edge.

Talking about engagement with Cilip members and others.  I'm sitting next to Hilary Ely, an official Twitterer. Tom Roper's nearby :-)

Caroline talking about the need for 'tactful discretion' as this is an open space.

This is not an end in itself she says...

Over to Phil...

2:33 Phil talking about the history of this event - his CILIP - epicFAIL post in response to Bob McKee's.

Talks about how CILIP is absolutely vital in what happens in LIS world.

"People care, people care strongly about CILIP and they want you to succeed."

He's talking as a 'critical friend'.

He's talking about the silent voice of those who aren't here - due to lack of tech, employers who block access.

 2:36 It's the activity that matters, not the tools.

This 'stuff' is allowing us to do things that we've not been able to do before.

It's up to us to engage...

Up to now we've had a culture that mistakes are a bad thing.

The rules are now changing: 'We can make mistakes' - we've only lost a few moments of time....

2:38 Web 2.0 is a state of mind - it's not the tools. Twitter, Netvibes et al...

2:39 We've got to stop doing some things in order to do other things (just realised I'm staring at a screen, listening, missing Phil's powerpoint)

2:40 We are not in a position to control the conversations - by having it on a Cilip website - people will go elsewhere.

You're moving out, onto Twitter etc.

2:41  What is it i'm expecting CILIP to do? Setting a good example or being a "horrible warning".

He doesn't mind which way we go - he'll use us as an example :-)

He wants CILIP to fail - to try things - to show what works and what doesn't, for others. To be at the pinnacle of what's happening.

2:42 CILIP needs to guide - librarians are already out there doing it anyway.

CILIP staff need to engage more - blogging, communicating.

CILIP also needs to be a pillar of support

2:46 I believe CILIP will be an excellent example.

Put events up on YouTube - interview people from Update and put that on YouTube. Do more on podcasts.

Actively engage with people - more than you are at the moment. Need more bloggers too; it doesn't have to be official. It's the engagement.

2:47 If the option you choose is to do nothing, you will get increasingly left behind.

Fear of criticism... either way such criticism is an opportunity to be involved and engaged.

2:48 Tales of One City in Edinburgh.

Includes Flickr, YouTube, Twitter etc.

CILIP needs to have a Flickr channel.

All of these work together - you end up with a jigsaw. 

2:50 This morning I went to CILIP communities. Why do I have to log in?

I get told about rules and guidelines. Once logged in, I end up back at the page where I started...!

(Round and round) ... message that I'm already logged-in... ?!

There's a limit on what you can do with the CILIP content here, can't comment.

Why do I need to download such content onto my own computer....

2:53 Final words, from Dewey and Ranganathan... the librarian militant and the librarian like Krishna!

2:54 Thank you very much...

Brian hoves into view...

2:54  Brian say he's putting his slides up on slideshare, and a video on YouTube.

We're living in a new world - and CILIP should be engaged in making use of these technologies.

I'll be looking at some of the dangers, risks too. [Slide of Uni of Wolverhampton Learning Centres Facebook page]

2:57 National Library of Wales strategy focuses on using external services - YouTube, Flickr, community wikis

Alan Cooper just told me comments coming in... forgot to look. No time! Too busy typing. Did post short tweet...

3.00 Brian talking about the Gartner hype curve.

Need to reshape the curve, avoid the trough of despair - manage expectations.

Beware of the IT fundamentalists (NB why am I typing this when I could just like to slideshare...?!)

And the Librarian fundamentalists. 'Think they know better than the user' etc. Think users should be forced to learn Boolean.

3:04 Talking about Ning. Talking about a PTEG blog - only one post a year (did he say that).

Examples of failure! 

What about school librarians who can't access things, the Council firewall gets in the way....

3:06 Council might be brought into disrepute by spelling mistakes on a wiki - or so Patricia Garrett found.

3:07 Reliability of Web 2.0 tools... Banks could go bankrupt, Brian used to say...!

It's what's there now that works for us - doesn't matter about Twitter etc.

[Sorry I'm not looking at comments below - I miss too much every time I stop typing; and I'm not getting even half of it. Don't want RSI ;-) ]

310 Encourage the enthusiasts - don't get in the way.

Looking at risk-averse cultures etc.

Critical-friends.org. Paul Walk is a critical friend to JISC.

Phil was a 'critical friend' with his CILIP - epic FAIL post.

3.12 'Should we be using this telephone technology?' - but people might use it for their own socil purposes.... 

3.14 Talking about some kind of big framework (I'm not exactly taking in the big picture - as I keep typing snippets)

Should CILIP allow people to tweet during work-time? Risks? 

3.16 Looking at Jo Alcock's blog etc. I've never met her, but feel I know her. She shares her experieces. She shares resources etc.

Is there a need for a CILIP manifesto? Educating people to be willing to take risks...

Web Tech Guy and Angry Staff Person cartoon strip (I think I used that in my Blogwatch this month, or was it last?)

Caroline thanks the two speakers.

3.18 Brian pointing to Twitterfall of #cilip2 tag being projected behind him.

It's a free focus group.

Bruce Royan says that the people who are remote might be getting a better experience than those of us at back of room! (It is quite hard to hear, at times!).

Ayub: wondering about Second Life. Going in too early - high costs?

Brian: costs of not doing it...

Jill Lambert: oops missed that. It was about Skype.

Brian: Bandwidth issue can be managed ... network shaper box [what?!?]. We've moved on on the skype issue...

Jisc Involve platform is working well...

[ Just refreshed my twitter search: '365 more results since you started searching.' Blimey! I'm missing all the Twitter chat...]

3.26 Caroline: Too many tweets to follow....

Phil: Second Life - if it ceases to be of value, then move on and find something else.

Bruce: Talking about the Second Life cilip presence, now unused.

Mark Taylor: Talking about how the CILIP second life island got set up. It was time-consuming. It wasn't that well-used. It didn't really seem worth it... The chap who set it up moved on...

[Just realised that I meant to put the new posts here at the top - but put them at the bottom Harder to project?] 

Bruce: what if Google brough up by Rupert Murdoch and Russian oligarchs? said a friend...

[Almost 50 people in the room]

Oriole: wants to hear from the 'great silent army' of CILIP staff (who are in the room). 

Edward Dudley: talking about costs of time and Marxism... :-)

Is he talking about ROI?

3.34:  Who needs professional journals? paper that Edward wrote. Who uses these services?

Isn't it about time we had some proper research on this?

Phil: We simply don't know the effect of these tools. If we'd known how good Twitter would end up being three years ago - when launched - we all would have been on it.

A central group needs to share what works/doesn't work.

If it's not CILIP, I'd like to know who it is...

Oriole: CILIP has the world's most user-hostile website...

Edward: And fewer staff to do the things it needs...

Oriole: The site just doesn't get better

Graham Robertson (non-member): Insitute of Chartered Accountants (? ICAEW?) member - shares his opinion that accountants are very specific information managers. He does info auditing.

He's talking about an ICA (?) site, where sections got opened up: http://www.ion.icaew.com/.

Phil: lots of places are still focusing on the website as the be all and end all. Tales of One City goes beyond this.

Talks about the collaboration element. CILIP can provide resources that we can channel material through.

 Oriole and Caroline talking about branches and groups, communication, twitter.

Richard Sedley (cScape, non-member) - 'new breed of information professional'.  This discussion you're having is replicated across profit and non-profit sector. CIPD doing good work with twitter. Don't feel you're behind with this...

I haven't noticed a purpose going into this discussion. Servicing the membership generally. But there are unique things about social media. Reaching out. Where do we want to be in a year's time in terms of membership increase?

Strategic objectives...?

Right now people must be thinking, Oh my god, netvibes, twitter etc, will I ever get to go home... :-)

3.48 Brian says he felt same when 10 and he got an adult library card - how am I go to read all this stuff.

Caroline: Q from Chris in Wales? Centrally in-house run vs general free services?

Bob McKee (has to go in 5 mins): We want to reach out to new members, yes. From culture of providers to culture of enabling and collaborating. Yes. Using web 2 is an excellent way to do all that.

I'm struck by the movement from concept of authority to a concept of collaboration. It happened with systems, now content. Does it need to happen with information people?

Conferred authority vs collaborative process? A societal trend that changes the meaning of the words management, professional and governance.

3.53 Phil Bradley: roles breaking down. 

Brian: data-mining the twitter discussions... cost of coming to London. Can CILIP justify costs of e-mail? Spam? Poor metadata etc?

Ayub: the people here are the interested people. How to get the ordinary people?

Phil: we have to take into account the people who aren't here. We need to be able to support them.

Librarians are often blocked from doing what they want to do - perfectly valuable activities.

Edward: CiLIP has perhaps 3000 members who are activists, giving up own time...

[I want to see what Tom Roper is writing, and Hilary Ely, and everyone else!]

Mark Taylor: PARN is doing a big survey on membership engagement in professional orgs.

Brian Kelly: Bob's provider vs enabler question. It's part of a much wider debate...

Richard Sedley: It's not just me that feels completely under pressure. People at desks have 2.6 minutes of uninterrupted time, one survey said...

CILIP could play active role in writing guidance for companies.

Brian:  talking about Belkin team role model, how Web 2.0 will work in different milieus (or smth like that...)

Phil: Suggested a new way to check e-mail with one librarian - would save 24 hours over a year (ie almost a week!).

I would like to push out tools to save time [How about the 'Getting Things Done approach that the geeks use!]

Lots of tools make people more effective.

Caroline: we're getting Tweets in asking what CILIP will actually try.

Mark Taylor: We need aims and outcomes first.

Penny Simmonds: The clunky nature of CILIP Communities. Can we make it more accessible?

We use e-Bulletins a lot. We're on Facebook.

Oriole: Might it be easier to start something new, rather than solve the problems of an earlier tool.

Edward: Gazette is brilliant....

Veronica Fraser: and Update....

Jill Lambert: Where do you think the gaps in communication are, Oriole?

Oriole:CILIP Communities has a bad reputation - ditch it.

Phil - I want CILIP to talk to me. CILIP needs an active presence on Twitter. I'd like to see CILIP using Facebook more, Flicker. I'd like to see that jigsawed into the website.

4.11pm

Bruce Royan: we still need to the old channels too. The CILIP website should link to all these Web 2.0 things, not hosted by CILIP.

Audience person (UCL student): Twitter has put me in contact with so many more people in the profession - more than meeting people face to face

Brian: CILIP2 is a top ten hash-tag for the day on Twitter! But then the spammers descend...

ID management issues: Karen B. found one website of hers coudn't be updated, as it was authenticated with an old e-mail address.

Brian share some of the Tweets... praise for this experiment.

Penny: but it did take a lot of staff time to manage it all.

Brian: but the next time it's easier...

Tom Roper (blogger): smtg I like on CILIP Communities -  CILIP blog landscape aggregator. That's a really rich thing.

We could aggregate lots of what CILIP's doing.

4.18pm

We want the website to be a bit like 'FriendFeed' for the profession.

Brian: Yes, CILIP as an enabler and channel [finding this conversation slightly painful right now as I've put together a  Web 2.0 tool that does lots of what's being talked about at the moment in the room, and by twitterers apparently, and would be useful to all members - but we're not sure where it's going, so I can't mention it.]

4.22 Caroline: Let's see what actually does work, get feedack, see how we can engage. 

On Council blog, we'll be identifying some of the areas we can have a go at in the near future. See which ways will be permanent ways for us to engage.

Sedley: Barriers to entry are now so low - what is unique about CILIP.

Phil: I want to see CILIP as a facilitator. But the barrier in some orgs is very, very high - as the librarian is simply told 'No' you can't do it. But if they could point towards their professional body.

Brian: CILIP to collect case studies...

Phil: not sure about CILIP accredited tools though. Better is 'this is what we've used - this is what worked, and what didn't'.

Bruce: a tweet about how much of this is down to individual members....

Brian: Shall we give some brief summaries, to help people, before we end.

Caroline: this will feed into the CILIP communications strategy.

We have become v aware that members think we aren't engaging proactively enough - some channels closed to non-members too.

Phil's CILP - epicFAIL blog was an opportunity for us. V interested in ideas of CILIP as a channel; case studies idea - lots of exemplars have been suggested.

Smn said they are more invovled in ALA's web 2.0 work even though they are in the UK!

This is the first step!
I'm personally very committed to engagement with the entire LIS community and our own members.

I will tease out the ideas that came out, share them back...

Tom's line: CILIP should be a friendfeed for the profession, I really like.

 Brian: hands up who's tweeting here: 6 hands go up. A wordle graphic has been produced too.

Caroline: at this stage we have to call meeting to a close. Thanks to presenters.

Applause!!

Caroline: hoping this is the first of many sessions on particular topics...

Lots of standing up, shuffling...

Me: Do I get to read all the tweets now? :-)

Some stat porn: apparently 59 people have been tweeting. There's even a list of top twitterers going round.

Last time the Community Server stats changed for the update blog - my blog post had had 845 views! A lot more than an average post would ever get in a day.

Are we still trending above 'swine flu'? ;-)

5.07pm Latest stat porn: there were 150 tweeters, 1179 tweets today, apparently.

Awesome.

Oh, 961 views of the Update blog....!

Wait a moment, the whole room is emtpy now. And I'm typing this. Time to go...

* * *

Here's a post I just wrote, explaining some of the background to this session - plus a query of my own about what the usage stats and trends are for the various Web 2.0 channels where CILIP members are currently active:

'Live blogging CILIP 2.0 open session - join in from 2.30pm today':
http://communities.cilip.org.uk/blogs/update/archive/2009/04/29/live-blogging-cilip-2-0-open-session-join-in-from-2-30pm-today.aspx

Matthew Mezey
(News Editor, Library and Information Update)